The Mental Load Women Are Carrying (And Why It Feels So Heavy)
March 23, 2026
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The mental load women carry is more than being busy. It’s the invisible work of remembering, anticipating, planning, checking in, following up, and holding a thousand tiny details at once. It’s not always loud, but it is exhausting. And for a lot of women, especially mothers, that invisible load is a direct path to burnout. […]
The mental load women carry is more than being busy. It’s the invisible work of remembering, anticipating, planning, checking in, following up, and holding a thousand tiny details at once. It’s not always loud, but it is exhausting.
And for a lot of women, especially mothers, that invisible load is a direct path to burnout. Not because they aren’t strong enough. Not because they need a better planner. But because carrying the emotional, logistical, and relational weight of daily life was never meant to be a one-person job.
In this episode of Don’t Cut Your Own Bangs, I interview Sarah Harker, Chief Growth Officer of City Moms, about career pivots, burnout, motherhood, and the invisible labor women often carry without even realizing how much is on their shoulders.
What I love about this conversation is that it isn’t just about big career change or entrepreneurship. It’s also about something so many women live every day: the quiet overwhelm of trying to hold everything together while still showing up for everyone else.
The mental load women carry can quietly lead to burnout. Here’s what it is, why it feels so heavy, and how to start sharing it.
What Is the Mental Load Women Carry?
The mental load women carry is the invisible labor of managing life behind the scenes. It includes not just doing tasks, but remembering those tasks need to be done in the first place.
That means things like:
knowing the school calendar
remembering who needs snacks, forms, shoes, medicine, or a birthday gift
anticipating what your family will need on a trip
tracking the household rhythm without anyone seeing the spreadsheet in your brain
This is why someone can look “fine” on the outside and still feel mentally maxed out.
What does mental load mean?
Mental load is the ongoing cognitive and emotional effort involved in organizing, anticipating, and managing daily life. It often includes invisible planning work that happens before any visible task gets done.
In other words: it’s not just packing the bags. It’s remembering that bags need to be packed, what has to go in them, what everyone will need later, and what will happen if something gets forgotten.
That’s a lot.
Why the Mental Load Women Carry Leads to Burnout
One of the most important threads in this conversation is that burnout doesn’t only come from working long hours. It also comes from being responsible for too much for too long without enough support.
Sarah talked about this both in her nursing career and in motherhood. She described a season where she was working incredibly hard, taking on more leadership, supporting everyone around her, and still trying to be fully present at home. That combination is so familiar for so many women.
Burnout often grows in places like this: when you are competent, capable, and caring enough that more and more gets handed to you.
The tricky part is that the mental load doesn’t always look dramatic. Sometimes it looks like being the default parent. Sometimes it looks like knowing all the details without ever saying them out loud. Sometimes it looks like being the one who gets asked, “What do you need help with?” when what you really need is someone else to notice what needs doing before you have to explain it.
That’s not laziness. That’s not a lack of gratitude. That’s exhaustion.
What Burnout Looks Like in Real Life
When people hear the word burnout, they often picture someone having a major breakdown. But many women experience burnout in quieter, more socially acceptable ways.
What is burnout?
Burnout is a state of emotional, mental, and physical exhaustion caused by prolonged stress, overload, and lack of recovery. It often includes feeling depleted, detached, irritable, or like even small tasks take more energy than they should.
Burnout can look like:
snapping more easily than usual
feeling resentful about things you normally handle
lying in bed tired but unable to truly rest
feeling like your brain has 47 tabs open at all times
needing a break but not even knowing what kind of break would help
That last part matters.
Because often, when women are carrying a heavy mental load, they aren’t just tired from what they did today. They’re tired from what they are holding tomorrow.
The Mental Load Women Carry Is Often Invisible — Even to Them
One of my favorite moments in this conversation connects directly to something I’ve seen in my own life too: sometimes you don’t even realize how much you’re carrying until someone slows you down enough to help you name it.
That is such a big part of this.
The mental load women carry becomes normal so quickly that it can start to feel like “just life.” You don’t always notice it because you’re busy functioning inside it.
A very real example: you’re getting ready for a family trip, and someone asks what they can do to help. You freeze. Not because there’s nothing to do, but because your brain is already running an invisible master list of medications, pajamas, backup outfits, snacks, water bottles, swim gear, bedtime routines, travel timing, and what happens if one child melts down before lunch.
By the time someone says, “Just tell me what you need,” you’re already exhausted.
That’s the load.
Another example: you’re not just making dinner. You’re noticing what’s running low, remembering who doesn’t like what, thinking about tomorrow’s lunch, and calculating whether there’s enough time before sports practice.
Again: that is the load.
Why Women Struggle to Share the Load
A lot of women do not struggle because they are unwilling to ask for help. They struggle because asking for help often turns into more work.
You have to explain the system. You have to delegate the task. You have to remember to follow up. You have to tolerate it being done differently. You have to carry the emotional weight of not sounding “too much.”
So instead, many women think: I’ll just do it myself.
And that can work for a while. Until it doesn’t.
Sarah named something so important here: the lie that “I just need to work a little harder.” That belief is especially brutal for women and mothers. It sounds responsible. It sounds admirable. But it often becomes a trap.
Because when the answer to overwhelm is always “try harder,” burnout becomes almost inevitable.
How to Start Lightening the Mental Load
This is where I want to keep things practical.
You do not need to overhaul your whole life this week. But you may need to get more honest about what you are carrying.
A helpful place to start is this: write down everything you are responsible for in a given week.
Not just errands. Not just appointments. Everything.
Include: the planning, the reminders, the checking, the anticipating, the emotional labor, the relational labor, the “if I don’t think about this, no one will” labor.
When you see it on paper, two things often happen: first, you realize why you’re tired. Second, you realize this isn’t “just in your head.” It’s real work.
Another helpful question is: What am I doing that does not actually have to be mine?
Not what could maybe be shared in a fantasy world. What can realistically be reassigned, owned by someone else, or done differently?
That’s where relief starts.
Burnout Doesn’t Always Mean You’re in the Wrong Life
One of the things I appreciate most about Sarah’s story is that her path didn’t begin with a dramatic reinvention. It began with noticing.
She started to realize she was more energized by supporting her team than by the part of the job she thought she was supposed to love. That curiosity led her somewhere new.
I think that’s such an important reminder.
Sometimes burnout is a sign that you need rest. Sometimes it’s a sign you need support. Sometimes it’s a sign the system is unsustainable. And sometimes it’s a sign that something in your life is asking to evolve.
You do not have to know the full answer right away. But you do deserve to listen.
Key Takeaways
The mental load women carry is the invisible work of planning, remembering, anticipating, and managing daily life.
Burnout is not only about working too much. It often comes from carrying too much mentally and emotionally without enough support.
If asking for help feels exhausting, that may be because delegation itself has become part of the load.
Lightening the mental load women carry starts with naming what’s actually on their plate and deciding what no longer has to belong to them.
If this resonated with you, subscribe to Don’t Cut Your Own Bangs, share this post with someone who’s carrying a lot, and send it to a woman who might need the reminder that she was never meant to hold all of this alone.
👉 If this episode resonates, share it with a friend who might also need this reminder. And don’t forget to subscribe so new episodes find you—no chasing required.
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DANIELLE IRELAND, LCSW
I greatly appreciate your support and engagement as part of the Don’t Cut Your Own Bangs community. Feel free to reach out with questions, comments, or anything you’d like to share. You can connect with me at any of the links below.
[00:00:00] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I remember seeing Janine and thinking, oh, I just really like to get to know her, but I don’t wanna bother her because she probably has people coming up to her all the time like that want something. And so I just said, hi. And appreciated that she liked to dress. then I remember at the dinner we were going around talking, it was all new entrepreneurs or small businesses at least. And there was just this general theme of isolation. I remember Janine said something and I thought, oh my God, I can’t believe she felt like that ever, because you just see this highlight reel,
[00:00:32] and I just thought, I really need to reach out to her after this, because that’s been a constant theme in my life now, ever since meeting Janine of I’ll meet these people and think oh, they’re probably like really busy. And then it, anytime I think that it’s like God’s laughing and it ends up being like a deep relationship going forward in my life of of course they need you in their life.
[00:00:53]
[00:00:56] Hello, hello, and welcome back to Don’t Cut Your Own Bangs. I’m Danielle Ireland. A therapist that wants to help you turn emotions into allies, not obstacles. And today’s guest is someone whose story starts in a place that will probably feel very familiar to a lot of us. That quiet moment when something in your life isn’t exactly wrong, but it’s also not right anymore.
[00:01:16] Speaker 2: Meet Sarah Harker, the Chief Growth Officer from City Moms, a national community that connects moms with resources, brands, and each other in a way that makes life feel just a little bit easier and a lot less lonely. What I love about today’s story with Sarah is that none of this started with a Grand Master plan.
[00:01:33] She spent 10 years working as a nurse and and or singing administrator in the cardiac department of healthcare mentoring teams, supporting people in high stakes environments, and over time. She began to notice something interesting happening and found herself becoming more invested in the wellbeing of the people she was leading.
[00:01:49] Not because she wanted to leave healthcare, but because she started asking herself a different question, if this isn’t exactly it, what might be That curiosity eventually led her to explore the world of entrepreneurship and ultimately to a dinner with a coach where she happened to bump into. Someone you might recognize from the podcast, city moms founder, Janine Bobmeyer.
[00:02:10] As the story goes, they bonded over the same anthropology dress. It was a total meet. Cute, and they shared a belief that women supporting women can build something bigger, that either one of them could alone. What followed was a partnership that helped grow city moms or make community rooted in Indianapolis to a platform connecting moms all over the country.
[00:02:29] Sarah talks about being a connector, someone who isn’t afraid to take a leap, to take a risk, and to build relationships that expand What’s possible, and what I love about this conversation with Sarah is that underneath all of the growth and leadership is something really simple, a belief that motherhood wasn’t meant to be done alone.
[00:02:47] Sarah describes a city mom as kind of like your best friend’s, older sister, maybe five years ahead of you who already knows where all the cool stuff is, where it’s happening, and is happy to show you the way it’s mentorship, community, and generosity wrapped into one. Just to give you a little preview of the energy of this conversation, about 15 minutes in, we actually had to pause the interview because Sarah got a call from her son’s school and right before we wrapped up, she had to let people into her meeting room to set up for another broadcast interview that was gonna be happening in just a couple of minutes.
[00:03:17] She’s a mover, she’s a shaker, she’s a connector, she’s a mom. And I am really excited for you to get to hear this conversation. So let’s dive in. Sit back, relax, and enjoy my conversation with Sarah Harker.
[00:03:28]
[00:03:30]
[00:03:31] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Well, Sarah Harker, welcome. Welcome to Don’t Cut Your Own Bangs. This has been a long time coming, but I’m so grateful that we’re finally here doing this.
[00:03:39] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah, I am too. And also I’m like, I have my bangs for you today
[00:03:44] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: You have
[00:03:44] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: on my own.
[00:03:45] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: you. That is, that is, that is the key. It’s like, not don’t have bang, because I’ve had a few people message me like, Hey girl, why are you hating on bangs? No, I love bang. It’s just like, don’t do it alone. Maybe go to a professional. You just, but they look great. By the way, every time I see someone with good bangs you have and your glasses, you have what I’m calling like an Anne Hathaway Devil Wars Prada moment.
[00:04:07] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: go on.
[00:04:08] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: well, because like she, it’s, I love how they like the trope of like, oh, she was wearing glasses and had bangs, but it’s like the inverse, Anne Hathaway and Devil Wars Prada. She like got very stylish glasses and really good bangs, and Stanley Tucci made her over. And then like, she was super chic.
[00:04:24] And I just, I love that.
[00:04:26] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: thought of that,
[00:04:28] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I love her.
[00:04:28] It’s family Tucci.
[00:04:29] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh God, yes. That’ll, that’ll be like a sub episode. Movies we like and things we should watch, which honestly that would be a fun episode to do too.
[00:04:36] Um, well, I’m so glad you’re here. And just to add a little context and background, so I bumped into you and your business partner, Janine, what, like not quite a year ago, but almost a year ago.
[00:04:48] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: It’s been a minute.
[00:04:51] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: yeah, Chu and it seems to, and since then, we bumped into one another, I think in the same place, same context, maybe three other times. And so now here we are. The thing I wanna start with, and you may you, you may find this a little silly, but a moment that is a standout for me in the conversation I had with Janine, Bob Meyer, founder of city moms, you bonded over an anthropology dress.
[00:05:14] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh my goodness. That’s such a, like testament to our current relationship. Still
[00:05:19] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yes. Like I, but I think that,
[00:05:21] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: I wanna, I, I want you to tell me a little bit more about your perspective of that story, because I think though as women, that may sound like, ’cause we could talk about like your business and your company and we will, and all of those big important like splashy fun headline things.
[00:05:37] But to, what I love about this community and this podcast is to really get granular, to speak to someone who, who feels lonely and isolated and wants to make a connection or is at the beginning of starting an idea and has no idea how they’re gonna get it off the ground. And what I love about the origin of your story, it feels so tender and it feels so real.
[00:05:58] Just like going into a lunchroom and not knowing where to sit when you’re in middle school. Like, oh my gosh,
[00:06:03] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: much like
[00:06:04] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: you so please tell me about the anthropology dress.
[00:06:07] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. Okay. Well first I am, figure this out very quickly. Janine is the detail oriented person of the company here.
[00:06:16] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: we work so well together ’cause we’re so different, I think in a lot of ways too. And then we share a brain in some ways too, but I think, um, I’m trying to remember if it was my outfit or hers that we started talking over.
[00:06:26] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: It was yours. So you walked in wearing a dress and she was like, oh my gosh, I have the same.
[00:06:30] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: It was like a one piece like emerald green. Yes. And that thing was beautiful. I wish I fell and snagged it like, um, on something and sadly don’t have it anymore. But yes, it was fabulous. Maybe I’ll send you a picture for context
[00:06:43] but yeah, we were at a mutual friend’s house for this big dinner party that she throws that is, um, just like out of a movie.
[00:06:50] It’s so neat. And it was one of the first things I went to, um, I was a nurse for a decade and was considering starting my own business and we were working with the same coach and went to the dinner party and I remember seeing Janine and thinking, oh, I just really like to get to know her, but I don’t wanna bother her because she probably has people coming up to her all the time like that want something. And so I just said, hi. And appreciated that she liked to dress. then I remember at the dinner we were going around talking, it was all new entrepreneurs or um, small businesses at least. And there was just this general theme of isolation. I remember Janine said something and I thought, oh my God, I can’t believe she felt like that ever, because you just see this highlight reel, on Instagram.
[00:07:37] And I just thought, I really need to reach out to her after this, because that’s been a kind of a constant theme in my life now, ever since meeting Janine of I’ll meet these people and think oh, they’re probably like really busy. And then it, anytime I think that it’s like God’s laughing and it ends up being like a deep relationship going forward in my life of of course they need you in their life.
[00:07:59] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. I love that. Anytime I think that someone is too busy, god’s laughing. It makes me think about . I’m paraphrasing a quote that sort of like, lives in the zeitgeist, but what you want or what you seek is also seeking you,
[00:08:24] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: that I can Oh, I can resonate so deeply with that.
[00:08:28] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. And it’s not like a bad, I wasn’t thinking oh, who would wanna hang out with me? Or something like in a mean way. I just thought oh, I bet people are approaching them all the time. And that would be like frustrating for them. And I wouldn’t
[00:08:42] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Anyway, after that dinner, I just remember thinking, oh, that’s so interesting. I never would’ve thought that about her. And then what was really funny is that was I had said at that dinner, I’m gonna put in my notice and I’m like doing the thing. I’m jumping and I don’t have anybody in my family that, um, is really into business.
[00:09:01] My dad’s a, a. But that’s a little different, owning your business
[00:09:05] There’s not like any, just entrepreneurs really in my family. And, what’s funny is Janine put down the date that I said I was resigning, and she texted me and said, , did you do it? And she told me when she was leaving, she was like, I’m gonna text you.
[00:09:21] And I just felt oh, that’s cute. But she really did remember and she reached out to me. She was the only person who texted me on that day and there were a lot of people there and so then we from then on out were inseparable and I was her plus one the things, so that, this is crazy.
[00:09:34] But that was eight years ago now. And, um, I’ve been a part of city moms for, since then. , And I was a part of it before I met her just on the sidelines.
[00:09:44] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: we really grew into sort of a, business. of comparing notes on how things are working with different things for both of
[00:09:52] I slowly stepped in with being part of the content team since I was her plus one. So I was always taking pictures for
[00:09:57] then last April, had the opportunity to come on as an owner. And
[00:10:02] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I can’t believe next month is April. It’s like we haven’t stopped to catch our breath just yet.
[00:10:07] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah, I Time is so it gets like stretch and warped and bend. It just feels so fluid and it.
[00:10:14] Great. And then, and we’re also recording the first Monday after daylight savings. I just wanna put that out into whenever, how I, I’m sure. We’ll, a week and a half or two weeks later, after this is recorded, hopefully we’ll all be adjusted, but, ugh.
[00:10:27] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: just time. Time.
[00:10:30] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I know. I got up this morning and I thought, why am I so tired? I get up at the same time every day. And then it dawned on me when I walked outside and it’s pitch black. I’m like,
[00:10:39] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: really does get you.
[00:10:40] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: yeah. We just reset that clock and then just kept plucking forward. Yeah. Yeah. Just an extra couple cups of coffee later. Um, but, so I wanna I’d love to go back, if you don’t mind. , something really peaked for me when you talked about, we saw the same coach, so you were practicing as a nurse for how many years?
[00:11:01] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: 10 years. Oh, that’s right. So 10 years working as a nurse. Can you bring me back when you were working as a nurse
[00:11:19] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: many squirrel moments.
[00:11:20] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: many squirrel mo. So wait. Okay. Have you seen the pit, have you held a heart in your hands? Like what? Oh my God.
[00:11:26] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I tried to watch it with my parents when I was there. My mom’s also a nurse and she started out in cardiac and she just retired not that long ago, after 42 years in nursing. I can’t do it. I’m just, I don’t know if it’s like trauma or something, but I just can’t even, it’s not relaxing for me to do that.
[00:11:41] If I’m watching, I wanna like laugh.
[00:11:43] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: one, the show was not relaxing, period. It’s just not I, I’m the same way with therapy. That show that Harrison Ford is changing. I know I, and I know the show was not specifically a, it’s not like the pit for therapy. It is a little different. But, there’s also a couple of reality shows that feature therapists and I can’t unwind,
[00:12:01] Thank you for the work that you did as a nurse, by the way. I truly, my life was forever changed from the kindness of a nurse in an emergency room when I had a miscarriage. Like she held my hand, literally and metaphorically. Um, I was just held with such care and grace by that woman.
[00:12:18] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: for
[00:12:19] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: And its always just, I’m always so appreciative of people who choose, the line of work. It’s so special. So you are working as a nurse. When during that run, did you start to think, huh, I wanna see a coach, and what led you there?
[00:12:34] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: That’s a great question. I think I was getting to the point, I remember thinking to myself. like taking care of my coworkers more than my patients.
[00:12:47] Was a last straw is when I had that moment. So I’m old enough that I worked when there were really safe ratios. Like when I started in nursing, you were only allowed to have three patients on the unit I was on, and now they take five to six on that unit. And at that time when I was at, um, that hospital, there would be things that would come up that I would be able to help people because I had the time to talk to them a lot more. And um, each year it felt like it just kept getting more of check off the list. You’re doing things for administration, you’re doing thing for insurance.
[00:13:19] And I really remember thinking, I feel like I’m gonna hurt somebody because I’m rushing so much and having to meet these things and it’s just not what I signed up for. Nobody goes into medicine or nursing to. To, or therapy
[00:13:32] check up a box. Like you have to have at least a heart
[00:13:35] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: No, that’s very fitting considering the type, like the nursing department you were in too. That makes sense. Yeah.
[00:13:40] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. And I just, I had a couple of instances where there were just like really disrespectful interactions too with other people. Certain people in certain roles are allowed to speak however they want to people.
[00:13:50] And I was, I’m just not a person that really sits by very well with that. And so I just thought, this is not gonna be very long. And I went through a period where I was like, okay, well then leadership is where it’s at. ’cause I just kept getting put in charge of things and, but there’s no extra money.
[00:14:05] Surprise. You work really hard, so here’s double the stuff to do. And by the way, you’re gonna train everybody. And by the way, will you be on this committee? And I went really far into that for a while, but I am. I really wanted to be present for my kids
[00:14:18] The last role that I was in. Nursing. The last thing I did was round for cardiologists. And so I would be there from five until five because I had to be there first to figure out I say that I was like, um, chaos control or
[00:14:32] A air traffic controller, because I’d have to know which doctors they’re on, who does what specialty, what different testing and different types of procedures, and then know where they’re gonna be so I can grab ’em if an emergency came in.
[00:14:43] And I loved
[00:14:43] I think that kind of helped me figure out too of, I’m not made to be like doing the same thing every day
[00:14:50] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: not made to have someone looking over my shoulder all the time. And so I think I was feeling that. But the big pull was that I was like, okay, when I’m trying to get myself into something that I don’t wanna do, I have to find something positive out of it.
[00:15:04] So I’ll I would. This is so silly and I probably annoyed so many people with this thinking back on it now. But I would write out a positive quote and then tape it to our Pyxis machine for the day for like the girls that I knew I was working with, depending on what they’re going through. And some of them would be like, oh my gosh, thank you so much. And they’d put it in their card or, or in their pocket or something and keep it. but I just really loved that and I was like, let me watch your patients so you can go eat and let me. So I was really focused on helping my team and I just have always really loved doing things like that.
[00:15:33] And I think my mom was, like I said, in nursing administration for years and I think I saw a lot from her on the other side as a kid. ’cause she worked a lot and so she was on two cell phones and I would hear her dealing with the surgeons and the nurses at the same time. And I always say I had Sherry’s School of Leadership of hard knocks first. And um, so
[00:15:54] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Built in, but that at that point I thought, you know what? I think I can do something with this, with, changing , how people are handling their lives, and to prevent burnout before it’s happening. Because everyone I knew is burnout, and that was pre COVID. So you know, well before
[00:16:08] Hardest part of their careers, most likely.
[00:16:10] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: And also I think , that language, I have seen the crescendo of that being talked about in a way that it never, Like
[00:16:18] self-care and burnout were talked about 10 years ago, but they weren’t, they weren’t really rooted in something that should be taken seriously.
[00:16:25] It was like, take a mental health day, which, what do I do with that besides like spiral and feel like I’m failing or,
[00:16:31] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: exactly. And sit and think of everything that needs done, and I’ll be there when you get back tomorrow.
[00:16:35] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yes, yes. Which leads to attention headache, which means you can’t sleep, which means the next day you should be rested and you’re not. But so, You were finding that you were enjoying taking care of your team more than your patients. So many things about what you said. I felt so deeply I couldn’t put positive quotes in enough places. Especially because I think to feel safe enough to leap into something new. I think about the stages of change, like back to motivational interviewing, like the pre-con contemplative stage of change where you’re getting ready to be ready to be ready.
[00:17:06] And it’s like, it’s hard to even see that as the early stages, but I really believe that’s using spring and maybe like gardening as a metaphor, that’s churning up the soil. You’re getting the ground ready to plant some new ideas in. And I just loved everything you said ’cause I saw myself in it.
[00:17:23] But can so you were taking care of your team and you were feeling really called, and you’re like, I think I wanna do something with this. But how did the coach enter in?
[00:17:32] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Okay. So this is the, this is a strange thing.
[00:17:34] Shout out to Erin Bridgeman. She’s you might know her,
[00:17:36] She’s best friends with one of my cousins, and I followed her on social media for a while, and I saw all the things that she was talking about.
[00:17:43] I never thought it was for me because I wasn’t in business I don’t know if you remember, but there used to be a company called Beautycounter
[00:17:50] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I loved it. My cousins, had a team with Beautycounter and they were like very big. I loved it because it was all about lobbying for safer ingredients. Scratch that itch with healthcare for me too, of, um, you know, if we’re not smoking, why are we putting all these things on our body that we know, have harmful ingredients? But I, so I had always wanted to have a family business because I saw that them grow up with a family business.
[00:18:13] And so they were like, oh, why don’t you do this with us? And I ended up doing that and really loving it and,, climbing to the like topper tier leadership with that. And so I thought, well, maybe I’ll talk to Erin about what I could do with this. Maybe I can just move into that full-time or take a break or something with my baby at the time.
[00:18:33] Then learned some really amazing tools and different things , around leadership, around money and wealth and, personal growth that I hadn’t, she introduced me to Jens Ro, who I had never heard of until then, and all of these really awesome, influential people that were very into taking risks.
[00:18:51] And at that point I felt like I had never really met anyone that did that,
[00:18:55] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I hadn’t, in my brain growing up it was like. You go to college and you get a job that’s connected to a paycheck. I remember hearing my parents talk about my friends that had like art degrees and that it was almost like a joke.
[00:19:09] And and it’s like they, there would always be this joke of like, what are you gonna do with that? Or whatever. And meanwhile they’re following their passion. And my parents don’t think like that anymore.
[00:19:19] of course they were like concerned parents thinking like, we gotta get this kid on our own feet. I just, there was no one in my life that was I don’t know what the opposite of risk averse is, but a risk taker I guess. And
[00:19:29] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: like an early adopter or they like, they just jump in. It’s like they’re always the first in line to get new technology. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:19:35] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: and everyone around me is risk averse. And so I always felt a little funny because I knew I’m not anal retentive and I’m not Type A.
[00:19:43] I always knew that part. But. I didn’t ever really explore that part until after I met Erin,
[00:19:49] that really changed a lot for me. And actually there are probably five people that I met at that dinner that are still close friends of mine. She’s just a magnet for good people.
[00:19:59] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: I am endless. I’m just endlessly interested in and curious about, and fascinated by what. What leads people to shift direction or change a path. And it always seems to start, even though like the details are different or where it ends up taking you is different. That place of I’m not satisfied with this.
[00:20:21] It’s like we have to experience the contrast enough to know, okay, well it’s not this, but knowing what it isn’t doesn’t automatically lead to its natural opposite. But that path of discovery of, okay, not this, but where am I feeling a little curious. I, I interviewed a guest a few weeks ago named Kat Greenleaf and she, used this language that I loved, which is, where’s the water warm?
[00:20:44] So like, where’s that current? And my kids, of course, are obsessed with Moana right now. So like, where’s the way finding, like following the path. , So you got curious about filling in these gaps, which led you to the coach, which led you to Janine, which. Let’s, okay. I wanna shift directions. It’s so when you look back at the Breadcrumb trail and you’re like, how could that moment have possibly led me here?
[00:21:08] But yet it has. I just think that’s so beautiful. But, so city moms, I want to know a little bit of what was it like for you hearing about it for the first time? Did you find your way in because you needed community? Were you wanting to receive what it was offering Initially?
[00:21:24] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: No, I actually remember thinking this is probably something people go through in their late twenties, but I remember saying I don’t need any more friends. I’ve got enough friends, and I’m good. You get burned enough. I think everyone in their late twenties is like, burned with these breakups that you don’t think about in friendships
[00:21:41] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Friendship, breakups are the worst.
[00:21:45] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: yeah, and
[00:21:46] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: just remember thinking like, I have such great friends already and
[00:21:49] Close with my husband and I have, I’m the oldest of five and I’m close with my husband’s sister and his cousins. And so I just thought I don’t need anybody else, which is, could be a don’t cut your own bangs moment, so yeah, no, that wasn’t what I was looking for. I think when I first started following city moms, I was just looking for stuff to do in Indianapolis and I knew that Janine always knows what’s next and what’s coming. And so I think that’s, um, why I originally started following.
[00:22:13] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. And so what would you say, like for somebody who might be hearing about, I mean, and I’m not so much thinking about the Indianapolis community, but for listeners who are outside of the Indianapolis community, because city moms is expanding everyone, it’s beyond Indianapolis. Mm-hmm. And maybe if you listen to the episode with Janine, you might be aware of that too, but just in case anybody’s listening and this is a brand new to them, what would you want people to know about city moms that are learning about it for the first time?
[00:22:41] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Sure. So we’re a national lifestyle media company, and so what that means is we do a combination of broadcast, nationally, I think we hit last week, officially 14 different markets across the us which is really exciting. And we love broadcast. We love going on,, lifestyle segments. And so we do lifestyle media on broadcast.
[00:23:02] We do editorial, that’s all SEO powered, and then also social media, to help get brands in front of the decision makers, which are usually moms.
[00:23:11] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: yes, yes, yes. So what would you say is one of the biggest problems that city moms is trying to help women and mothers solve? So for you it was like stuff to do. Like, I’ve got these kids, and they’re like tearing my house apart what’s going on? And
[00:23:30] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: mine. Mine are just angels that
[00:23:31] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh, that’s so sweet. I’m happy for you.
[00:23:39] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: So when people say they’re one of five, I’m like, oh, are you okay? Like, are you okay?
[00:23:44] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: that’s a mess. That’s a conversation for your couch.
[00:23:47]
[00:23:50]
[00:23:50]
[00:23:50] Speaker: If you’ve been listening to this podcast and you’ve thought to yourself, dang, I really wanna do some deep diving. I wanna ask myself some bold questions, but I don’t know where to start or I’m ready, but I just need someone to help hold my hand through the process. I have a tool for you called The Treasure Journal.
[00:24:05] It is a seven part guided journal that is. Infused with and informed by my therapy practice. There are sentence stems, so you never have to feel stuck looking at a blank page. You never have to wonder where to start. There are stories to help remind you that you’re not alone in this process, and to kick off some of the inspired creative thinking that really gets the healing process going.
[00:24:24] And also there’s lots of blank space in the back. If you think, okay, I loved answering this question, but I wanna take it further. There’s space for you to make that practice your own. If you’re welcome to visit the link in the show notes for the Treasure Journal and you can grab your copy today.
[00:24:38]
[00:24:39] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: okay. Help me understand like, what are the problems that you’re helping moms solve?
[00:24:44] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. I, that’s a really great question. I think probably the biggest thing would be, just the overwhelm and the mental weight of everything that we do is such a, oh, that’s a whole other podcast on its own right. But I
[00:24:57] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: getting, filtering through the noise finding, we have a campaign that’s coming up.
[00:25:00] It’s one of our biggest campaigns that we do every year called Best New Baby. So something as simple as going, finding what those best new products are and getting them in, in front of you, doing the research ahead to show what are, some of those best choices. travel is another one that we do a lot of.
[00:25:15] We work really closely with tourism departments and so doing that work of going and finding the places and just selflessly eating all of the food for you and staying in the nice hotels
[00:25:26] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: . So generous, Sarah? Yes.
[00:25:28] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. Anything we can do to help to share the weight of that mental load. And I think there’s such
[00:25:33] just a me too of we’re in this together is such a big thing, every day almost we start off our social media just by sharing a reel from another woman, another mom that’s in the middle of it.
[00:25:45] Just sometimes it’s laughing, sometimes it’s sad, and it’s just reminding that we’ve got each other and that we’re not doing this alone.
[00:25:51] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Well, one of the things I think city moms does so well, and I would just encourage, and it’s all linked in the show notes too, but I love that the whole feel of the city moms page and you land on it. It’s, you immediately get a sense of community. There’s zero performative or pretension or I just interviewed a woman named Ashlyn Thompson, last Friday. And , she helped co-found the Parent Empowerment Network and she has a podcast called Empowered by Hope.
[00:26:20] And she talked a lot about this idea of reclamation over reinvention. And will like spiral with is this sense that she has to treat her life like a project she has to optimize.
[00:26:29] it’s always about improvement and getting more done or getting more fit.
[00:26:32] But city moms feels like the counter to that, that
[00:26:37] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: That’s such a nice compliment.
[00:26:38] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: it, but it is, it’s just, I feel like you’re either learning something or you’re feeling entertained and connected
[00:26:43] When you wanna feel uplifted, this is a good place to go.
[00:26:47] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: That’s amazing. Thank you. Can I put that on our website?
[00:26:50] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Please do, please do. Because I, I mean, it, it’s, it’s so beautiful but I wanna know, what in your opinion, makes city moms different than other communities? Like it? Because it completely stands alone, which is why I think it’s going national. ’cause you’re filling, you’re filling a gap.
[00:27:07] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh, that’s a big question. Of course, everyone’s gonna tell you that there’s nobody like us.
[00:27:13] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: every person that you ask is gonna say
[00:27:14] If they own a business. But I think, big area where we stand out is definitely broadcasts. We’re just always excited to reach more moms and talk to more people
[00:27:23] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: I’ll just say too, maybe I’ll answer my own question for you, which I promise this, I wasn’t soft pitching myself to answer this question.
[00:27:29] I think you and Janine, you genuinely want to connect women with community, with resources, you want to help make their lives a little easier.
[00:27:41] Take shoulder, some of that decision fatigue, one less decision to make, one less problem to solve, one less meal to figure out. And it just, and that translates, that really translates because I’ll, I’ll just say there’s a lot there, there’s so many experts.
[00:27:56] but I think what you guys, as much as we love a good expert, sometimes we just need a community.
[00:28:09] To hear. Yeah, I think we actually, we started a, another platform this year for connecting, with our city moms. And we actually decided to close it because we realized everyone’s connecting on social. And
[00:28:22] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: think we wanted it out there. So it was more open, less barriers for other people, and that’s always the goal. I think even with our, some of the work that we’ve done this past year, we’ve started working with brands to help be the liaison between influencers and content creators. So especially in the parenting space. And that’s been really, another fun way to come alongside people
[00:28:45] of that weight of, oh, I don’t know how to do this and make that a easier flow for them as well.
[00:28:51] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: but we’re always just keeping our eyes out with that. I mean, Janine, I love that she uses this phrase, but she says, city mom is really cooler older sister of your best friend.
[00:29:02] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: yes. Like she’s the five years ahead of you.
[00:29:06] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: think that’s fun to be that, because we always wanna be out to this next wave of moms.
[00:29:13] I don’t wanna say generation ’cause it’s not necessarily a full generation gap, it’s, who can we help mentor into that space? And again, just make it real and not there’s this striving for perfection, but just be real together.
[00:29:25] I’m curious, so when you were describing just a few moments ago about like what you’re not, I’m not Type A and I’m not overly detail oriented, but you obviously, like you were, you bought into the company and you were brought into the company because of what you do.
[00:29:41] Tell me, what is the, what do you bring to
[00:29:44] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh my gosh, that’s so funny. Yeah. Well, what a loaded question. You are. Such a good question. Ask her like, you should do for a living or something.
[00:29:51] Well, of course I would love to say that I bring the fun because that’s like the biggest thing for me. Anytime I’m introducing anybody, I’m like, well, they’re fun and Janine’s and what else do you do? That’s the first important thing for me.
[00:30:04] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Cool. What else?
[00:30:05] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: yes. And, um, I am just a natural connector. I think that’s my favorite thing in the world is connecting other women to each other. And so I think that’s a big thing.
[00:30:14] I also am not really afraid of much. we were at something a couple weeks ago saw somebody who’s.
[00:30:21] Really well known in Indianapolis and I was like, come on, let’s go talk to them.
[00:30:25] Engineer’s whoa, stop. But they’re right there. She’s send them. I’m like, they’re right here.
[00:30:39] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: there’s a plan. And I am pretty strategic too, but I’m, um, more of a jump and I think that’s part of what is really great with the, the both of us is we support each other
[00:30:48] Things like that.
[00:30:48] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: that’s, I love that. That’s beautiful. You are a connector. I have a, like a good gut feeling about people, but I don’t know if, like, my mind works in that way, like for my husband is a connector. I would say some of the closest girlfriends I’ve had in the last 10 years have been introductions that he made out in the world.
[00:31:10] He is almost like handing out my card. You should call my wife.
[00:31:13] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: need a friend. Yeah.
[00:31:14] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: a supportive husband.
[00:31:15] Always tell people whenever I’m meeting them for the first time or telling them I’m gonna connect, I’m like, okay. I know some people say they’re gonna introduce you to people, and then it’s just oh, they mean well to be bombarded in your inbox. I just hate that when somebody tells you like, oh, I wanna introduce you to so and and then you don’t wanna be, a pain in the butt asking for follow up with that. But
[00:31:35] Just so many great women too, so it gets, it makes me really excited to get to do things like that.
[00:31:40] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: okay, so that’s your strength. You’re a risk taker. You go for it. You’re fun. And every someone, every someone’s gotta be in charge of the fun in the group.
[00:31:47] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I can do that. I’ve got you go for there. um. Yeah. And I think, something funny when I started that company
[00:31:54] I was sort of like a foot out the door of nursing because it was still in healthcare. It was to serve people in healthcare. but I printed, know, the little badges that all the healthcare people were, I printed these that I would hand out when I was talking to different groups.
[00:32:06] And it said, a mantra on the back of it that said, I have the power to be influential and I stand tall in that today. I felt like that was such a powerful thing to really, if you really stop and think about it. And I think that goes back to that, meeting Janine the first time. It was something similar of, rather than thinking, what if you’re responding to these situations?
[00:32:26] Not in a way of, oh, I don’t wanna be a burden or whatever. But you think of it as. The of, I have the ability to be influential and
[00:32:35] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: the person might need you. And I think I, I put that into play since learning that lesson myself quite a bit because, I’m a firm believer that there’s plenty of room for everybody. And, I know you hear people say that a lot. I’ve had people, I’ve heard people say that before and then they’re not, the last person that would offer another seat at their table
[00:32:55] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yes. You can tell people who mean it from a place of abundance and people who say that from a place of scarcity. It’s just, yeah. Yeah.
[00:33:03] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I think, Janine and I both very much believe in that, and that’s so important to us.
[00:33:06] We just launched a new program this year with city moms called the Local Edit, and with five local. Women own businesses to help support them in Indianapolis. As we grow nationally, we, Indianapolis is so important to us. We wanna keep people coming here for tourism and, just working with them to help elevate their brands to a wider base too.
[00:33:27] So when we’re going to places like Kansas City or Dallas, we’re taking their product with us as our gifts to people to help promote those brands and things. So that’s, you know, we’re always looking for an opportunity for how we can help pull up that next person. There were other people that opened the doors for us through a lot of things, and we wanna make sure that we’re doing the same thing back.
[00:33:46] And it’s not
[00:33:46] A cute tagline. Right,
[00:33:48] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: sure. And I think believing in where you stand and believing in the value you offer it, bringing people up behind you, it’s doesn’t feel threatening because you’re like, well, I am uniquely. Position to do exactly what I’m doing. It actually reminded me a little bit of back. I didn’t seek a coach in person 10 years ago, but I did join.
[00:34:09] Marie Forlio. She created an online business called B School. Yes. And when I was transitioning from a commercial actor, ballroom dance teacher, and this was pre going? Yeah. I started working in commercials when I was 13. My biggest like claim to fame was I did, uh, a zombie commercial for the Walking Dead, but it was all for a lottery scratch off ticket. Like I fought a zombie, got their finger, and scratched the, so that was that actually funded my grad program because
[00:34:37] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: so funny.
[00:34:38] Yeah. That’s how I paid for grad school. But yeah, so I, I. Lived a very, feelings forward, like whatever felt right, but I always felt like I was fumbling and stumbling forward. I didn’t have a plan. I was certainly not strategic, and all I knew through most of that process was not this.
[00:35:00] What is, what is this? That whole transition. I tried on a bunch of different jobs to try to figure that out, and it was during that transition of kind of fumbling and failing forward that I thought, maybe I’ll try to work for myself somehow. And so that’s when I joined B-School.
[00:35:15] All of this to lead up to something she shared in that, that really spoke to well, there’s already enough of those. I don’t need to throw my hat in the ring. She was like, if you were to think of your favorite Italian restaurant and , but can you name five other Italian restaurants outside of your favorite?
[00:35:31] Of course you can, but like, no. Everyone who starts that restaurant says, well, no one knows my Nona sauce the way I know my Nona sauce. it just, there’s, does the world need another? I don’t know, but I’m so glad my favorite exists.
[00:35:55] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: we do.
[00:35:55] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I heard another version of that before and it was if Lizzo said, but Beyonce already exists. It’s oh, there’s just, some other pop artist and black woman in this industry and they don’t need any other, imagine if we didn’t have some of those anthems.
[00:36:12] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: would we be missing? We would be missing so much.
[00:36:16] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Well, so, i’m just curious, what was that moment of I think we need to think bigger.
[00:36:21] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. Well that was before me. Even in COVID I think is probably what Janine would tell you is the answer
[00:36:28] She really saw a need for where things shifted online and then we were, seeing a big increase in where people are coming from last April I came in as the chief growth officer to really push it
[00:36:40] With that. There’s always a point in time in entrepreneurship when you’ve got to wear another hat and it’s nope. Now they’re all toppling over, and there’s, we need the, I love that book.
[00:36:52] who Not How, and I think that is probably the spot where we got to with that. And um, but Janine built such an incredible foundation already for that, through broadcast is really what pushed us, um, out for different markets.
[00:37:05] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: the Drewer show. I remember that happened during COVID. I remember
[00:37:09] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: just a little drop, but
[00:37:11] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yes. And I was in that with her, which is fun, even though I wasn’t working with her.
[00:37:15] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: well as Chief Growth Officer, so like growth is scary. Growth is desired. I love setting goals. Ooh. I could brainstorm. My favorite thing is to like lunch brunch and brainstorm that. Oh yeah, let’s get all the ideas. Let’s throw it up on a whiteboard. Oh, that’s so tasty. And then to actually push the boulder up the mountain.
[00:37:48] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: And what do you wish more people knew about that process?
[00:37:52] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Wow. Everything just goes back to the don’t cut your own bangs moment,
[00:37:56] We have a solid team of project managers and our director of project management is wonderful. We work with a lot of content creators and we really need all of that support. I think that’s the big thing is yeah, you could have the really big ideas, and Janine and I love having those, but we also really love strategizing and putting in the work we actually have to have., Like limits. Sometimes I’ll lock my computer in the car at night just as I’m like, I’ve got to put work away. That’s a hard thing when you really love what you do. I don’t wanna miss the important stuff with my family too, but it’s really easy to get, you get excited about something and get going.
[00:38:34] So we have those moments of the brainstorms and I think the strategy is where both of us love being the most. And then we’ve got a great team that also will, help move that along with project management
[00:38:47] the big thing. I mean that I loved that book Who Not How, it was really funny if you don’t know the backstory of that. The author actually didn’t even write the book. He was like, I am not a good writer,
[00:38:57] I hired a ghost writer,
[00:38:58] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: I’m so glad that more and more people are actually talking about that openly, because it’s absolutely, it’s affirming when people can really own, this is my zone of genius. And then I hired someone for their zone of genius.
[00:39:12] I think that’s the biggest thing, and it’s likely that’s anybody that you’re looking at. We just, we have a great team behind us too, that it takes all of us together to make it work. So I think that’s the biggest thing is it’s not just me,
[00:39:23] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: so with growth, would you say the thing that like you wish more people know is you don’t have to grow alone like you?
[00:39:29] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I think you don’t have to grow alone. And I think we so often get this in our heads of, um, I just have to work a little harder. And I think that’s such a lie, especially for women and moms of, I just have to work a little harder. I had,
[00:39:43] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: in my beauty counter days, I had dinner with the CEO and founder Greg Renfrew at the time and I asked her like, what’s one thing you wish, more women knew in business?
[00:39:54] And she said, how many? I thought this was so funny that she picked us. ’cause I would’ve never guessed. She said, how many male CEOs do you know that are cutting up snacks for their kids soccer team? I was like that. that was such a pivotal thing that I needed to hear at that time because I was building my business and I’m, trying to be the first person when the school calls and, to get the kids and I wanna, gotta keep the house clean and, all these other things that with so much more pressure and,
[00:40:26] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: I just, I had a nice conversation with my husband after that too, and he was like, yeah, you’re right. But, so I think
[00:40:33] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: I.
[00:40:33] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: the means to delegate some of those things, like you and I were talking about whether it’s funding by a Walking Dead commercial or how figuring out, um, making a list.
[00:40:45] What do you do every single day, every single week, and what of that can be delegated? And it’s really not as hard as you think, and that’s like the best exercise in the world to do. ’cause you feel so good when you’re like, no wonder I’m freaking tired. Look at what I’m doing. So I try to do that. If I ever have a friend too that’s going through something, I’m like, let’s just start here
[00:41:05] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: through, let’s literally circle what doesn’t have to be you or what do you hate doing
[00:41:08] one of what’s not filling you up and what’s draining you.
[00:41:11] It’s taking from your capacity in other areas.
[00:41:13] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: And I would even say like a, a really big call to action is when you’ve done this exercise or even if you think you’ve done it, there’s always more room than you. Because I just recently came back from a Disney cruise and in the preparation and packing for this trip,
[00:41:30] the family trip that had been taking previously. My husband and I had a really, I don’t even, I don’t remember how we got there, but we were having one of those like tense, prickly, moments with one another.
[00:41:40] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: sexy stuff. Yeah. And, what came out of that was I wasn’t aware of what I was holding myself accountable to in terms of thinking, thinking through what will my kids need
[00:41:56] each day we’re on the trip.
[00:41:58] I’m just talking through this with David and he was like, wait. What, he was like, this, you are holding all of that in your brain.
[00:42:06] And then it just, it brought so much more clarity and context because it was just information he was missing. He was like, well, no wonder when I come to you and ask what you need help with, you’re like, ba, because you just, you’re carrying the,
[00:42:18] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: This entire, he was like, that doesn’t feel balanced.
[00:42:21] I don’t feel good about the fact that you’re doing all of that for yourself. And I wasn’t even aware of what help I needed to ask for because it, I was just carrying it. All that to say, yes, make the list, sit down with a friend, do exactly what Sarah said, and then maybe give yourself grace when you find, oh, there’s a 2.0 and there’s a 2.5 and there’s a 3.0 version of the list.
[00:42:48] Okay. I just, I’m laughing because this is, I literally have these in my bag to take to somebody today. Have you heard of
[00:42:54] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: No
[00:42:55] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Okay, so, these are literally every possible task associated with owning a home or having a family. And you literally, I saw this and I was like, why would anyone make this?
[00:43:10] Do they want a divorce basically? And because it seems like a really great way to have
[00:43:16] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: And, but I, it comes with like specific instructions. Definitely follow the instructions. This is not a paid ad. I don’t work for them. But I actually did it with my husband and um, last year. And so you basically put who’s doing what in the pile?
[00:43:33] And then you look and it’s is it equal? And if it’s not, then whoever it’s not spoiler
[00:43:38] gonna be equal. Then you have to choose, and this was really hard for me. You have to choose what card you’re giving for them to own and then they own that card.
[00:43:47] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: we’re trying to do like a, um, quarterly check in with this of do you wanna trade a card or something like, I don’t know.
[00:43:53] I’ve taken out the trash like the past six times and, and because I got tired of saying, it’s your card. It’s your card. So like this next quarter I’ll probably be the trash person or one of the kids will get
[00:44:03] it really was helpful to rebalance those expectations. I think that’s another thing is, know, when you’re looking at growth, making sure you’re not just looking at work growth and that you’re thinking about what’s gonna fall.
[00:44:14] ’cause we all know it’s a balancing act that doesn’t exist. no balance.
[00:44:18] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: and I love in terms of think, ’cause I think sometimes our fights get boiled down to things not being equal or fair. But I think thinking about what feels equitable and Brene Brown talks a lot too about it personally. Checking in with what your capacity is before trying to ascribe to or assign a role.
[00:44:36] It’s like all, all of that nuance is great. But also I love a good card deck. I love a good card deck.
[00:44:42] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: That’s a nice tool.
[00:44:43] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: like recommending it, but I wouldn’t just jump into it, especially if you’re mad, don’t bring it up. Wait until you’re calm. And yeah, I think it was really helpful for us to, for sure.
[00:44:53] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: So you’re saying this isn’t the tool to break up a fight, this is just,
[00:44:56] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: the tool to break up a fight. And I would even put some kind of a ground rule of
[00:45:03] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: because the point is partnership.
[00:45:04] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Right. That’s great. Well, Sarah, I, this isn’t a smooth transition, but nevertheless, we are here and I want to know about your, don’t cut your own bang moment before you hop off
[00:45:16] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: well, I think mine is, and we’ve touched on it a little bit, I think, right when I was shifting from nursing into my own business, I had this idea, the whole goal was to help prevent burnout in healthcare.
[00:45:29] And what I think is really funny is that what ended up happening is every client that I worked with, I ended up telling them to leave healthcare. So the whole goal was to keep all the people in healthcare that I saw leaving because they were burnout. And it like was too late by that point.
[00:45:47] It was literally the opposite. Truly all leaving healthcare, but in some capacity I was recommending they leave their current role.
[00:45:53] Because, we’ve seen, and in the past decade, a lot has happened in healthcare
[00:45:58] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: It’s not like there’s this debate anymore of, is our healthcare system broken?
[00:46:02] when I started that company, there was a big debate about that. In fact, my parents that were in healthcare, one of the first things my mom said was like, nobody’s gonna buy this. And I was like, thanks mom. That’s awesome.
[00:46:11] And I think, now there’s nobody who’s questioning is there a need for a change in healthcare?
[00:46:17] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: but my don’t cut my own bangs moment was definitely like thinking, oh, I’ve got this figure out, like I’m gonna da. And it’s nope, this is a huge issue in many other facets.
[00:46:27] And I think what I ended up figuring out, not intentionally, it was more of that curiosity that you were talking about is working my way through, um, different steps that ultimately led me here with, just being open to what the real goal is.
[00:46:43] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: You know, going back to this is a little bit of a bookend of, thinking, well, I don’t wanna bother somebody, just that’s God laughing. The moment the millisecond, I think I’ve got this figured out. Ha.
[00:46:54] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Well, every time,
[00:46:56] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Oh boy. There. So someone somewhere is laughing you do this is a growth moment.
[00:47:01] sarah-harker–thecitymoms—she-her-_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. Let’s see that.
[00:47:02] squadcaster-3j5b_1_03-09-2026_130515: Yeah. We’ll, yeah. We’ll pressure test that theory. , Well Sarah, thank you. Thank you so much for, for taking the time. I’m so glad we were able to do this and, and bring this together. And, for everyone listening, just the fair play card deck and tell me the book title again.
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